View Full Version : Gojo's Playhouse! (sterile room, fruiting room, incubation room)
Hey all!
I finished building my sterile room with an antechamber (decontamination room) and I hooked up a new HEPA air-filter (99.97% and to 0.3 micron). I'm not trying to make the room 100% sterile or anything, just more sterile than my OLD house tends to be when I have a few mice, a cat, 2 ferrets, one fish and 3 dogs :) The sterile room is 4' wide by 5' long by 6.5' high, plenty of room to work! The antechamber is 4' wide by 3' long by 6.5' high.
The fruiting room is also built from 1 and 1/4" PVC and 2 mil clear painters drop plastic with a lot of duct tape! I will have (2) stands of racks in the room, each can hold 300 pounds and each is 1' deep by 3' wide by 4.5' tall with four levels. That leaves plenty of room for me to move around and for the cool mist too. I will expand this fruiting room next run. For now my fruiting room is only 4' wide by 4' long by 5.5' high. The temp stays at 76-78 and the humidity is at 90-93%.
The incubation room is a closet which I [will] lined with pink hard insulation. Then I added a $25.00 space heater with thermostat to keep it at 80-85F.
By having three rooms I'll have a constant flow of new LC's, quart rye berry jars, spawning h.poo bulk sub and casing containers, etc...new grows and new strains every 2-4 weeks or so as I'm only gonna do only two flushes per container. The three room setup is like a clone/veg room, mother room and flowering room for cannabis.
Right now I've got a liquid culture of p.cube spinning on the magnetic stirrer, I'm going with Ecuador this run. Next grow I've got some Golden Teacher and then some Quezon (maybe, they grow best on straw so it's be fun).
Enough talk, time for neat pics! These first 5 pics are the construction of the sterile room and antechamber, with a view of the outside and HEPA filter. The first pic is the sterile room without a door and without the antechamber. The second pic is the same as the first plus a door and a pic of the zipper for the door in the third pic. Finally the 4th and 5th pics are of the antechamber and sterile room with HEPA filter:
Antechamber and sterile room:
In the following pics you see inside the sterile room and inside of the antechamber.
The first two pics are of the antechamber, it has sterile gloves, face mask, alcohol and paper towels and clean cloths: long sleeve and hooded shirt, pants and socks. I change cloths in the antechamber and put on the gloves, etc to help keep outside contamination outside (and besides it's fun). There is strong positive pressure from the air-filter going into the antechamber and out to the surrounding room.
In the final pics you will see my ad-hock Lamar Flow Hood. It's a HEPA air filter rated for 256 sq ft, lol, I keep it on low. Like I mentioned it offers the same filtration as real flow hood. I set a table in front of the air filter's flow and a 'deflector' to the right, this makes the air flow straighten out and get a lot lager in volume (hight and width). You will see the area I marked as "FLOW" with black marker, anything in that area is my 'work area' in the flow of clean air:
Fruiting room:
Like I mentioned the room for now is 4' wide by 4' long by 5.5' high. I've got a single cool mist humidifier in there and it keeps the humidity at 90-93% when I run it on high 24/7.
I will add lighting to the room when I start fruiting, maybe next week I'll add the lights. I ordered special blue heavy fluorescents (Vita-Lite) and UV-a bulb (RepitSun 5.0), both of those offer wavelengths within p.cubes action spectra. Regular fluorescent bulbs (even at 6500 kelvin) don't offer wavelengths in the action spectra...though light is FAR less important in the growth of mushroom than it is for cannabis.
FAE (Fresh Air Exchange) is done via the hole behind the intake of cool mist humidifier. I keep the cool mist running on high, it's a "ReliOn" and has a really strong fan. It sucks in FA from the outside and the room isn't sealed too well so the old, stale air can escape (ala FAE). There is a slight positive pressure in the fruting room, enough to bring in fresh air and expel old air while puffing out the sides of the room and keeping the humidity over 90% and about 75-78F; all with one cool mist humidifier (1.25 gallon and $20 el' cheap-o from Walmart).
And the pics:
Incubation room:
Not much to say here but it works like a charm and I could do a TON of jars if I had a need...one day, lol.
Anyway, it stays at 80-8F and when I add the insulation I will save more money because I can turn down the space heater (900watt when running!). This also doubles as my AEM and FPE incubation room :)
Here the pics :)
c-ray
08-31-2008, 06:25 PM
nice!
I hope you remembered to put a roof on that sterile room ;)
Hey bro,
yea it's got a roof :) . Funny thing was I was all stoned when I was making it and when I tested it the first time I forgot to unzip the door to the sterile room...so when I turned on the air filter I almost blew the room up! I guess I sealed it too well and it looked like a puffed out 'puffer fish', lol!
Anyway, after talking to you and Springs I'm branching into gourmet mushrooms as well, and I'd love to eat homegrown mushrooms.
I started my LC yesterday and I'm stirring 24/7 so I hope to see some growth by tomorrow or the next day. I used a 2% light malt extract powder and 2% dextrose (corn sugar) with distilled water for my LC.
later :)
Springs
08-31-2008, 08:31 PM
Looking very nice gojo! Very pro!
Are you going to put a chair in the clean room?
What hygrometer are you using?
Hey Springs,
Thanks man! You got me started in all this, hell, a few weeks ago I didn't even know what the martha tek was, or what a mono tub is, thanks for helping me get started. :)
I'm getting a chair tomorrow and I'm using a "sunleaves" digital indoor/outdoor 'hygro-thermometer'. But I don't use the outdoor setting because it's not very accurate so I just put it inside the fruiting room.
All told the 1-1/4" pvc and fittings, duct tape, 2 mil plastic and pvc 'scissor' (don't get a saw, the cuts are not clean) cost me about $175-225.00 at Home Depot and all fits in a small spare bed room.
Oh and are you still interested in trading spores (prints or vacationers w/spores?). I have Ecuador, Golden Teacher and Quezon. I could send you off a few prints of a few nice Ecuadors from my first flush in like 4-5 weeks.
@ ALL:
In my pics above you will see a jar with amber color liquid in it and a hose sticking out the top of the lid. These are so-called "Agar stye" LC (Liquid Culture) lids, it has a 1" length of 1/4" fish air line which is stuffed with "polyfil" for FAE (Fresh Air Exchange and to keep out contaminates) and you'll see a red RTV self-healing injection port. This works really well and is inexpensive but I don't like the look of it, it's not 'clean' looking and is clunky. So I'm ordering some Whatman .45um autoclavable syringe filters[1], vacationers[2], rubber stoppers[3] and I already have micro-pore tape and a rubber gasket (for LC lid, from Ace hardware). Soon I'm gonna make 'optimal' Agar style lids for LC (w/seal, Whatman air filter and heavy duty vacationer lid injection port) and an 'optimal' Agar style grain/wbs lids (w/no seal, micro-pore tape over air-port and rubber stopper for injection port). I don't need it but I'd like to use it, it just seems to be much more 'clean' and I'm kinda OCD at times.
Here's a good thread:
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/6339502/page/0/fpart/1/vc/1
[1] Whatman filter for LC air port:
http://www.smallparts.com/s?searchNodeID=16310161|468240&searchKeywords=whatman+13mm+syringe+filters+0.45+p olypropylene&x=0&y=0&Action=submit
[2] Vacationer stoppers for LC injection port from many fungal stores and science stores
[3] Rubber Stoppers:
http://www.sciplus.com/category.cfm/subsection/7/category/84
Pics: The pic on the left is of the top of the lids, the lid on the left is the LC lid and the lid on the right is the grain/wbs lid. The pic on the right is the bottom fo the lids, the lid on the left is the LC lid and on the right is the grain/wbs lid.
Springs
09-01-2008, 07:47 AM
Yo gojo!
Ive got an some spores headed my way, not sure if eq is in it, ill let you know. Ive only got the one strain still, malabar, ive got a stack of prints ;)
Those lids are the shit, slick, simple, and effective. Too bad agar didnt follow through with his commercial asperations. I use poly and tyvek for grain, cost is $10 per hundred thousand lids :p and for LC's ive been using vehicle washer fluid hose stuff and sealed with rtv, and rtv as the self heal injection. It doesnt look as sharp, but it works :D
It worth it to have the pro lids the time it takes to "dress up" lids is a pain in the ass if your doing alot, its one of those things.
peace
Hey Springs,
I'd love some Malabar if you have an extra print or two...:fish: Once you get your prints in let me know what you have and I'll buy a bunch of others you don't have, so together we could have a TON of strains! I want Penis Envy just because it's always out of stock, I think Hawks Eye has them...
Did you find the Shiitake 75? I want to grow gourmet too, not right away as I have to get my investment back with p.cube first. But after that I definitely want to grow gourmet and medicinals eventually too.
The p.cube's are hopefully going to give me enough funding so I can start a new cannabis grow in a few months in a new house :) I'll start with LUI and Mental Floss as in the winter my back is always more painful. But I'm still really bummed about my outdoor Willie Nelsons...I'll have to start some of those soon!
Those lids are the shit, slick, simple, and effective. Too bad agar didn't follow through with his commercial asperations. I use poly and tyvek for grain, cost is $10 per hundred thousand lids and for LC's ive been using vehicle washer fluid hose stuff and sealed with rtv, and rtv as the self heal injection. It doesnt look as sharp, but it works
It worth it to have the pro lids the time it takes to "dress up" lids is a pain in the ass if your doing alot, its one of those things.
I feel your pain, I've got to make 50 grain lids today and tomorrow :(, and 50 isn't even a lot in the grand scheme. I also have to collect over 150 pounds of horse crap this week from the fields and processes it too...
It's crazy especially considering he ordered 10,000 Whatman air ports! What the hell did he do with them all? I think he's a major commercial mushroom grower and maybe sells them only to those 'in the industry'?
For grain I like using the RTV injection port as I will inject with LC along with doing g2g eventually, for FAE I use the micro-pore tape over the hole on top of the lid. How do you attach the tyvek? The thing I like about using micro-pore tape instead of tyvek or polyfil (in terms of FAE and contamination blocker) and an RTV injection port is it's fast to make and can be used over and over again. And I like the versatility, it offers injection or g2g in one re-usable and PC-able lid. I bought plastic lids at WallMart for like $5 per 8 count.
When I make those pro style Agar LC lids I have to order like 25 Whatman air ports and about the same vacationers rubber stoppers. I only need like 5-10 LC lids and a BUNCH of grain lids. How many LC lids do you need? If you send me new plastic lids I'll make you Agar style LC lids with my extra Whatman filters and vacationer stoppers. Then I'll send them back to you, interested? It should be like 10-15 LC lids for ya! :)
Later! :)
Oh yea,
After I pasteurize the h.poo I'm going to mix in some vermiculite and oats, and then to re-moisten I'm going to use AEM at about 1:50 along with yucca (no preservatives) and cold processed kelp extract (no preservatives), humic acid, black strap molasses and MetaNaturals calcium...all to feed the microbes and the dead microbes from AEM, yucca, kelp (K) and calcium are for the p.cubes...
Stamets always suggests calcium carbonate and gypsum for calcium, yet neither will provide adequate Ca in the short time mushrooms are grown on a sub. He suggests calcium carbonate (calcitic lime; 'c.lime') to raise pH and offer Ca; well it does raise pH right away (if fine powder) but it doesn't add Ca right away. And gypsum doesn't offer Ca fast enough either, not to mention it's only 'active' when media pH is over 5.5 and can actually do harm[1]. So for those reasons I am including MetaNaturals organic calcium as it's immediately available and I'm adding c.lime for pH adjustment. The MetaNaturals calcium is from c.lime and they used vinegar to extract the Ca, it also has humic acid extracted from kelp.
My casing is going to be peat with vermiculite and c.lime. I'm going to use the same water mix as in the h.poo sub minus the Ca. The c.lime I'm gonna use is fine powder or better yet micronized if I can find it. I don't like how ppl use h.lime at shroomery. I'm in a tug of war with RogerRabbit about that right now, I'm about to post a bunch of info about why they shouldn't use h.lime and should use only c.lime. RR and many think there is no immediate effect pH from c.lime, that's why they add h.lime...:rolleyes:
Oh yea, how much (% or ratio) of bokashi did you want me to add to my sterilized rye berries? What results are you hoping to see?
And a really neat point is that p.cubes and many other edible fungals prefer an acidic pH. P.cube's yield and potency is highest at 4.0-4.6 pH. And by using AEM (specially the LAB) the pH is best low, not to mention the microbes which will protect the media from harmful microbes. And adding h.lime to casing is suggested to bring pH to around 8! What I really like about using AEM is that we can keep the pH real low around say 5, preclude bad microbes and feed the higher fungals (like p.cube) with the dead microbes from AEM. This should increase yield and potency and happiness of mushrooms :)
There is a great section in The Mushroom Cultivator about the symbiotic and synergistic relationship with p.cube and microbes (p.353). Not to mention all the info about beneficial microorganisms mentioned throughout the book.
Here's a great PDF I put together:
(attached to this post)
"The Production of Psilocybin in Submerged Culture by Psilocybe cubensis"
by P.Catalfomo and V.E. Typler, Jr., 1963
This PDF is a great source of hard data on macro and micro nutrients, tryptophan, glucose, thiamine, ph, etc, a good read! I couldn't find it anywhere but then I found that "Anno" had uploaded it as a set of GIF images. So I downloaded the images and made a PDF out of them for the community :up:
Maximum production of both mycelium (dry weight) and psilocybin (percentage basis) occurred in acid medium, and both underwent a decline as the pH of the medium began to rise after the ninth day of fermentation. It was noted that psilocybin was produced during the most active growth period of the organism.
...AND...
Maximum yields of both psilocybin and mycelium occurred in the acid pH range (4.0-4.6). However, the acidic nature of the medium does not preclude the possibility that the internal pH of the organism is maintained at a different level by an efficient buffering system.
A quick excerpt of what I'm going to post to RR in this thread: :http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/8853832/an/0/page/3
--------------------------------------------------------------
Hydrated lime = around 140 TNP (Total Neutralzing Power) and 100% of it will pass through a 60 mesh screen with a ENP (Effective Neutralzing Power) of around 2520 (lbs/ton).
Calcitic lime = around 99% TNP and 99% of it will pass through a 60 mesh screen with an ENP of around 1168 (lbs/ton)
The ENP is the main number we are interested in. A higher ENP means faster reaction. But as you can see c.lime does have an immediate effect upon media pH and is less likely to harm the fungals as it's not as 'strong' as h.lime. Any lime with a TNP of around 100% will have an immediate effect upon media pH.
See "Liming Materials" at http://ohioline.osu.edu/b472/0004.html
The type of lime used is very important, the most important factor in choosing a c.lime is it's "fineness". It is listed on the bag, it should pass almost 100% through a 60 mesh screen to have a good immediate effect. And if you can find or order micronized it's even more immediately available. As long as the lime is screened to a fine size and is moist it will raise pH right away.
"Master Gardener Decision Support Guide: Lime Questions and Answers"
http://www.ces.ncsu.edu/cabarrus/staff/dgoforth/limefaq.html#L7
What is hydrated lime?
When water is added to burnt lime, the lime forms hydroxides. Gardeners calls this hydrated because we don't know if hydroxidated is a real word. This material is bulkier than agriculture lime. It can be used when plants are not present but can burn plant roots. It is more caustic than burnt lime. Most gardeners will use agricultural lime instead.
http://www.ces.ncsu.edu/cabarrus/staff/dgoforth/limefaq.html#L29
How fast does lime react?
Lime starts reacting immediately if moisture is present but it takes several months for the total benefit to occur.
http://www.ces.ncsu.edu/cabarrus/staff/dgoforth/limefaq.html#L12
Can I use burnt lime or hydrated lime for gardens or landscape?
It can be used when plants are not present but can burn plant roots. Both are more caustic and disagreeable to handle than agricultural lime. Most gardeners will use agricultural lime instead.
"Most Asked Agronomic Questions"
Ohio State U:
by Jay W. Johnson and Don Myers
Bulletin 760, Chapter 1
http://ohioline.osu.edu/b760/b760_1.html
Liming and pH
1. How long does it take for lime to work?
The length of time that it takes for lime to neutralize soil acidity depends upon the type of lime used. Liming materials differ widely in their neutralizing powers due to variations in the percentage of calcium and/or magnesium and impurities (silt, clay, etc.) contained in the limestone. Refer to Table 14, page 18 of the Ohio Agronomy Guide, 13th ed. for a listing of the TNP (total neutralizing power) of various agricultural liming materials. Usually, liming materials with high TNPs tend to neutralize soil acidity faster than those with low TNP'S.
The coarseness of the liming material will also influence how fast the lime will react. The finer the liming material, the greater the surface area and the faster it will react with acid soil.
[1] Gypsum info:
http://www.ces.ncsu.edu/cabarrus/staff/dgoforth/limefaq.html#L20
What is gypsum?
Gypsum, is calcium sulfate. It doesn't change the soil pH. Applying gypsum to an acid soil (pH less than 5.5) can have adverse effects on certain crops by displacing soil aluminum, which is toxic to plant roots. Use lime until your pH is at the desired level. Then use gypsum to add more calcium.
Can gypsum be used instead of lime?
No. It doesn't change the soil pH. Use lime until your pH is at the desired level. Then use gypsum to add more calcium.
Later :)
Springs
09-01-2008, 09:42 PM
Ive already got that pdf on my desktop ;)
Whats your thoughts on lithothanmion(is it mion or miun?) or maerl?
Hey buddy,
Do you mean in terms of pH or Ca? I think it's too 'unpure' with too low TNP (Total Neutralzing Power) for use as a quick pH adjuster for mushrooms. For cannabis I think it's got promise! :)
I mentioned to RR that one could pre-mix the casing with c.lime and moisture. Then let it sit for a few weeks to a month (or more) for full activation of pH. Then pasteurize and use. But I think just 'fine' c.lime is good, but I'm going order some micronized c.lime soon...hell, I wonder how much a 'micronizer' is? I would love to have one and I'd micronize the shit out of everything!
Here a bit of info on marl and it's pH attributes:
http://www.ces.ncsu.edu/cabarrus/staff/dgoforth/limefaq.html#L11
What is shell marl?
A high calcium clay containing shells. It can supply lime but is more slowly available than pulverized limestone.
...And this is interesting "bog lime"
What is marl?
Often used to refer to bog lime. Technically, a lime/clay deposit. It can supply lime but is more slowly available than pulverized limestone.
BTW, I have all of RR's vidoes in mpg4 format if your interested...:up:
Later bro :)
Oh yea,
Any other PDF you have? I've got the following:
An Action Spectrum for Light-induced Primordium Formation
The Effect of Light upon Basidiocarp Initiation in Psilocybe cubensis
Growth Effects of Brassinosteriod
Tropisms in the Mushroom Psilocybe cubensis
Would you like any of them? Trade? ;)
Springs
09-02-2008, 01:33 AM
Nice, thanks for the info. Lots of experimenting to be done! Going to be fun :D
As for maerl I was thinking as an addition to a compost or fermentpost, then buffered with straw, for a sub.
Im just curious what the effects of a mass amout of microorganisms would be to the stages of growth. Ideally it be nice to to do alot of jars with various amounts and alot of control jars with a cloned specimen, fruited from the jars in the same environ.
Ive got a bad habbit of clicking "open" instead of "save as" when I read pdf's, there mostly gourmet and medicinal studies and patents. Id like to read your collection though, they sound good.
:stir:
Hey buddy,
Nice, thanks for the info. Lots of experimenting to be done! Going to be fun :D
yes going to be fun!
I just spent some time is the pastures and picked up about 150lbs of great h.poo, nice and old, but not too old ;), smells like earth. The GREAT thing is the horses only get organic alfalfa for food! And alfalfa offers N, along with it has a good amount of inulin (esp in roots) :)
As for maerl I was thinking as an addition to a compost or fermentpost, then buffered with straw, for a sub.
Yes that's a good idea, I've been thinking a similar thing but just adding straight micronized marl to sub for immediate Ca. But I like the idea of composting it, etc. It's gonna be more availbe at that point for sure, and it will help stablize pH if it's been composted for while.
Are you still looking for a source of marl? I've got a source of micronized (35um screen)and un-sanatized marl in the US for about $20 per kilo. I think a minium order is about $200.00. I want to do and order next month, want to go in on it with me?
I'm getting ready to start a new bokashi pile soon, just for p.cube. I'm going with inulin heavy plants, kelp, oats, etc, etc.
Im just curious what the effects of a mass amout of microorganisms would be to the stages of growth. Ideally it be nice to to do alot of jars with various amounts and alot of control jars with a cloned specimen, fruited from the jars in the same environ.
Yes I agree. I've plans to clone a few nice mushrooms for testing. I'll do a few multi-spore LC jars (1/2 pints prolly for testes) with like 100% bokashi (no verm layer and un-PC'd) and 50/50, 20/80, etc (bokashi to PC'd rye berries), etc. Any ideas on ratios or methods?
This run I'm soaking some of organic rye berries in like 1:20 (AEM:water) with 3ml/gal yucca extract for 20 hours, then heating for a bit [not above 120F] (per the "RYE BITECHES RYE!!!" tek). After I'm done heating I'll strain and soak rye in 1:20 (AEM:water) for another hour or two (I don't want to get the rye so moist they burst). Then I'll inject with LC directly without PCing.
I'm also going to PC some jars with the above mentioned rye soaked in AEM. Then inject with LC. The dead microbes should serve as food, Stamets mentions this with p.cube too.
Sub:
For my sub I've got h.poo, fresh EWC where worms were fed pickled stage bokashi and Biozome only, store bought organic EWC, store bought organic composted cow poo, hort grade vermiculite, yucca extract as surfactant (no preservatives), kelp extract (no preservatives), humic acid, baby oatmeal and oat flour, micronized marl or MetaNaturals Calcium, black strap molasses (for LAB and yeast) and hydrolyzed fish (for p.cube and Pnsb).
For good yucca info I posted this thread (https://www.cannabis-world.org/cw/showthread.php?t=4870), I have some Ag Aide 50/50 on the way. I can send you a few ounces if you'd like? It's low application rates should go pretty far. I'm also gonna see if C-ray wants a few ounces too.
So I think I'll use:
pasturizeed: h.poo, EWC and cow poo
mix in vermiculite, oats and marl (if used)
re-saturate sub mix (to about 70%?)
Application rates I'm thinking about: **What do you think?**
(I'm using the low end of suggested application rates of amendments to go into water)
10 parts h.poo
2-4 part oat meal (thoughts?)
2 part EWC
2 part cow poo
2 part hort grade vermiculite
distilled and boiled water
3/4 cup AEM (1:20)
(I want to use a high ratio of AEM to water to insure a fast colonization of sub.)
5 ml/gal yucca extract (Ag Aide 50/50)
3-5 ml/gal hydrolyzed fish
3-5 ml/gal kelp extract
3-5 ml/gal blk strap molasses
2-3 ml/gal MetaNaturals Organic calcium (a syringe via CC conversion is easiest measuring method I find)
5-10 ml/gal humic acid
(my humic acid calls for application rate of 1:20 but I think I'll only use that on one sub container, the others I'll tone it down something like 1:80, 45ml/ga or 1:150, 25ml/gal)
Ive got a bad habbit of clicking "open" instead of "save as" when I read pdf's, there mostly gourmet and medicinal studies and patents. Id like to read your collection though, they sound good.
I've attached them below :up:
Thanks! :)
Springs
09-07-2008, 09:30 PM
Sounds like a crazy experiment!:yowza: I think its safe to say, that is one of the most complex substrates ive read about :kitty: I like it! :D
Be sure to run a control bulk sub, not very hard to mix some hpoo and verm and spawn ;)
Im more in the ghetto club at the moment, no funds means no fung's. Although I harvested and ate my first homegrown pleurotus yesterday, tasted like fish :)
Hey man,
Yea I'm playing around a bit, I've got some micronized gyspum and micronized calcitic lime (47 micron screen) :)
I'm going to do mostly everything the 'standard' way, with like 3-5 'test' trays (and I don't want to loose my whole grow with my 'tests' ;) ). For my standard trays it will be like h.poo, 20% verm and 5-10% gypsum with a 1:4 mix of spawn cased with peat/verm (50/50), 5% gypsum and c.lime until pH is at 8-8.5.
For testing of inoc I'm gonna do the following (basically):
100% bokashi (wheat bran); no PC
rye soaked in AEM like I mentioned, heated and re-soaked; no PC
rye soaked in AEM like I menteiond, heated; PC'd
rye soaked, heated; PC'd (this is the majority of the jars)
rye soaked in water/coffie, heated, PC'd
rye soaked, heated, mixed with 30% bokashi; PC'd (this is what you wanted me to test right?)
That's all I can remember off the top of my head...
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